How are we saved

edited December 1969 in Random Issues
2 questions

How are we saved? (other than the cross because if it were just the cross there would be no point of hell)

Are we supposed to be sure of our salvation?

Thanks in advance for answers and Pray for me


  • [quote author=Crazy4Christ1 link=topic=9300.msg114898#msg114898 date=1275410407]
    2 questions

    How are we saved? (other than the cross because if it were just the cross there would be no point of hell)

    Are we supposed to be sure of our salvation?

    Thanks in advance for answers and Pray for me

    People will come up to you and ask you :"Are you saved?". What annoys me is that they will ALWAYS ask you this ONCE you tell them that you are a Christian already. The reason is that they don't believe you are saved unless you are like them.

    Their ideology is quite dangerous and anti-scriptural. Here are a few proofs.

    If you respond with "I am saved" - how can you know for certain that your behaviour in the future won't change? Despite God's guiding hand on you, you STILL have the free will to say YES or NO to God at any stage of your life.

    Even St Paul feared of losing his salvation or being "rejected" by God (See 1 Cor. 9:27).

    Saint Paul even taught us to show similar caution, to be always vigilant, and to strive until we attain the Heavenly Kingdom.

    Saint Matthew 10:22 and 24:13 highlight the importance of striving until the end.

    The entire Bible for that matter warns us of the exact fault and arrogance that these protestants who are "saved" from!!

    Look at the story of the Wise Virgins and Foolish Virgins. The only difference between them was that the wise were vigilant, the foolish ones - ALTHOUGH they were prepared , and although they were invited, they did not wait until the Bridegroom came. THey got sloppy. I guess they felt that seeing as they were invited, that they could enter into the Kingdom anyway: But the doors were shut on them!! You are invited also to the Wedding; but unless you actually bother going there, and enduring the trials of life and waiting for Our Lord, you won't be let in. Being INVITED != BEING LET IN.

    You agree?? The next time some Charismatic CHristian tells u "ARE YOU SAVED"???? Tell him / her the story of the 5 foolish virgins, and say that "I have been invited to the Wedding, yet I must be worthy now to enter - and being worthy means the need to wait vigilantly at the doors, and be attentive.. not to go and assume that because you have been invited, that you'll be let in when you haven't even made any effort in waiting."

    Let's explain this clearly.

    Christ did ALL the work for us to be saved. His victory over death and sin through his cross and resurrection is indeed COMPLETE AND DEFINITIVE. That means that there's NOTHING else left for Christ to do.

    But, while the Lord's triumph over death is certainly an accomplished fact, YOUR PERSONAL PARTICIPATION IN THAT VICTORY IS FAR FROM COMPLETE!!!!!

    St Paul states: "Not that I have already obtained this or have already reached the goal; but I press on to make it my own".

    We are tempted EVERY single day of our lives. Your baptism is the precursor to a huge diabolical battle anyway - the devil won't leave you until your last breath, and Christ won't accept you unless you have been vigilant against these tribulations.

    The problem is NOT in Christ's sacrifice that it is in ANYWAY incomplete (!!!) ... the problem is in the confidence we have in our own faithfulness and stability. The problem is with our human frailty. Therefore, MOST orthodox Christians remain hopeful and yet fearful.

    This is a very serious matter. WHy on earth is it the people who are the most ignorant have the loudest voices?!! And they say this stuff "ARE YOU SAVED" with such confidence that its as if they've discovered water, and the rest of us have been drinking sand.


    So - in nutshell, Christ died for you to save you. That means you have been invited to the wedding. Great. Good for you.
    Now, its in your hands to NOT only show up, but to wait like the 5 wise virgins.

    I am so mad at Protestants for evangelising this ASSURANCE doctrine - it is completely ridiculous and against scripture.

    Your incorporation in Christ is gradual. It is progressive.

    Through the Graces we receive in the Holy Communion, bit by bit we come closer to growing in Christ. We gradually confess and repent our sins. Whilst all this is happening, we are pruned and tested (read John 15 - I am the Vine).

    Ultimately, our incorporation of CHrist in us, in our beings starts at Baptism.

    This is the most interesting part. I do not see how these people telling me they are saved, are in fact saved themselves as they don't even have baptism. Its not the sacrament per se that perhaps they miss, but it is what happens MYSITCALLY in the sacrament of baptism that they do not recognise. It is recognition of what happens in baptism that defines our spiritual path. The old testament, the fall of Adam, the inheritance of a corrupt nature DOES NOT make sense without baptism. So, I find it hard to believe how evangelical Christians are saved without this.

  • this is the best answer i have ever heard but its also the 1st time i got an answer. i dont think anyonecould have explained it better. thanks and god bless
  • Thanks,

    I don't blame you ONE bit for asking this.

    Our Church is bombarded so much by protestant ideology. Whilst they may be privy to partial truths, they are lacking in a lot of things. Any orthodox Christian (ANY!) - is clearly in an enviable position, and I would be saddened for any Orthodox Christian to be swayed into thinking that they do not require the life Giving Graces of the Sacraments to help them in their attainment for the ultimate goal.

    This is not works. Protestants have misunderstood this COMPLETELY.

    They will tell you that if there's ANYTHING you need to do to be saved, then this is a "Works Gospel" and it devalues the work that Christ did on the Christ. Not at all. Far from it.

    As I said, there's NOTHING left for Christ to do in order to save us. But we must, however, be worthy now of the Kingdom of Heaven. He has given us ALL the means for our salvation: it is now up to us to respect them and make use of them!!!

    In the mass of Saint Gregory, we say: "You gave me all the medication that I need, I am the sick". So, Christ's life giving sacraments are my medication. Surely it is now up to me to keep on receiving them, or not. Its that simple. We can be sure that Christ forgives us our sins, IF we repent them! So is repentance a work??

    I am applaud your question. I am worried for ANY coptic christian who has been influenced by this "Saved by Faith" and "Assurance" Doctrine.

    Now, let's consider Baptism: Is Baptism "a work" -

    This is the fun part in such a discussion. Baptism is a life giving sacrament. Through it we wear Christ. Through baptism, we receive forgiveness. Through it, there is renewal. Why am I saying this? Because without baptism, I personally cannot see (LOGICALLY) how anyone can be saved. We talked before about the importance of YOUR INCORPORATION IN CHRIST'S VICTORY OF DEATH: right?

    How do we become INCORPORATED into His Victory of Death? How??!!!!

    This "HOW" is HOW we are saved. It is through baptism. Through baptism, we WEAR Christ. We put him on, and we become INCORPORATED IN HIM. We die with Him, and we rise with Him.

    We become members of His Body in Baptism.

    So, why isn't baptism enough? Who said it is NOT enough? The problem is, we sin after being baptised. Therefore there needs to be a continual "maintenance" of this gown of righteousness that we are wearing. This is achieved through confession, repentance and Holy Communion, and ESPECIALLY reading the Holy Bible. God's word will help in cleansing your heart. You must read it daily.

    If we were to be baptised and we neglected to confess any sins we might do after our baptism, the result is worse. The judgement is harder. For we will be judged according to what we have been given.

    Baptism corrects in us the deformed/corrupted soul we inherited from the fall of man. How then can protestants benefit from any sort of salvation if they do not recognise this mystery of "putting on Christ"???
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