Hoos Lobshes

Peace to all, 

Based on what order are the Hitens at the end of the first and second hoos lobshes ordered? For the first hoos lobsh, it is through the prayers of Moses the prophet and then the intercessions of the Virgin St. Mary. In the second hoos lobsh, it is through the prayers of David the psalmist, the intercessions of the Virgin St. Mary, and the intercessions of the chorus of the angels. Why is it ordered this way specifically? 


  • Here is my tuppence but I am sure someone more well learned can shed better light on this.
    Now those two lobshes are not like the commemoration of saints, and like the respective hoses they link the Old Testament to the New Testament so it follows that either Moses or David are mentioned first.
    St Mary comes as the first one in the New Testament and in the second lobsh the angels are mentioned because the words of the lobsh refers to the Lord creating them. The third lobsh, however, are the words of the three saintly men, so no addition to Biblical text, except of course for the verse where we ask their prayers..
    Ⲟⲩϫⲁⲓ ϧⲉⲛ Ⲡϭⲥ
  • There is also the the fact that all psalmodies have them in that order. I haven't done research in older manuscripts, but still, all mainly agree on that now. 
  • edited December 2019
    So if it is a link for the Old Testament and the New Testament, why are the angels mentioned last, weren’t they created before David and St. Mary?
  • Good point @thoktetegom, but I guess the way I look at it at least is that they are after both the Old Testament and the New Testament, that is in eternal life. Let's not forget that midnight chants and bright Saturday where those lobshes are chanted are a miniature example of the passing into eternal life..
    Ⲟⲩϫⲁⲓ ϧⲉⲛ Ⲡϭⲥ
  • @ophadece, I see your point with the angels being throughout the Old and New Testaments and into eternal life so maybe that is why they are mentioned after. Thanks.
  • Thank you @thoktetegom, that's only my interpretation.
    Ⲟⲩϫⲁⲓ ϧⲉⲛ Ⲡϭⲥ
  • The very old psalmody manuscripts includes only one hiten for Moses and only one for David, you can refer to those manuscripts :
    - Vienna copte 3
    -Hunt 256
    Those two manuscripts date back to the 14th century, and regarded as the oldest versions available..

    The hiten for saint Mary is found in more recent manuscripts.. Those who added it were not accurate (or did not care) about the hierarchy of intercession, so the order was not accurate..
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