In or out? Or both?

edited December 1969 in Random Issues
I've heard a few recorded liturgies in which the lead chanter says some responses that are meant for altar servers. I have heard it from a liturgy with CIA and another with Boles Malak (I believe).

Does anyone know what the deal with that is? I am assuming (and am very confident) that there wasn't a shortage of chanters. . .so why are they saying altar responses while serving as chanters??


  • *bump*

    I was expecting a quick reply on this one. . .

    It really doesn't make sense - why are some chanters also saying the responses that are for 'deacons'?
  • ILSM knows.

    .....everything ;)
  • what responses exactly are you talking about??
  • I have heard liturgies where chanters said al qari2oon pinishti and otlobo for the departed. To be honest I have also done this quite a few times  :-[
  • [quote author=christ_rose link=topic=12512.msg146872#msg146872 date=1320079332]
    what responses exactly are you talking about??

    I don't remember.
  • Pinishti is a deacons response. Sometimes when the deacons inside do not know it etc. the deacons outside will say as a group. and because the congregation knows most of it some churches say it communally. otlobo for the departed i say it the long way outside sometimes depending also on who is serving in the altar. el kare2oon ive never heard from outside before.
  • I assumed people would know what I was talking about. I'll try to find the liturgy recording and get back to you on which hymns they were in specific.
  • I would like to bring up a point: You only need 1 priest & 1 DEACON to do a liturgy. That's the rule... so yeah the deacon can do both inside and outside responses.
  • [quote author=christ_rose link=topic=12512.msg146895#msg146895 date=1320113185]
    otlobo for the departed i say it the long way outside sometimes depending also on who is serving in the altar.

    Not to derail the thread, but do you by any chance have a recording of this hymn besides the HICS 1971 version?
  • i believe i have it in the St Cyril liturgy and i think i may have muallem tawfiks recording dont quite remember tho
  • Andrew,

    I have an old record of Fr Bishoy Kamal in Sporting Alexandria where an entire additional section was said during the epiclesis by the outside deacon solo and the remaining outside deacons responded with Tinahti Amen. I initially thought it was one of the inside deacon but you can tell from the voice that it was not the inside deacons. I have never found the text of this additional section. I think this is one more example of the hymn school of Alexandria (mostly under Muallem Habib) is different the Cairo school (under Muallem Mikhail Batanooni) and the Sahidic school (under Muallem Tawfik Youssef). I think this is similar to what you are describing. I would not be surprised if the liturgy you speak of was performed in Alexandria.
  • In my church, there is no orginazation at all. Those who should be higher level deacons are lower (just because of age).

    Many men wear the badrosheen (however you spell it) just because all the other older men wear it, and I don't even think they're ordained as Epsaltos. The lead deacon in our church can't even read Coptic, which really bothers me a lot. Church levels shouldn't be about age. It's just one of things that if you're not doing right, then just stop.

    Sorry if I got off topic, it's just that some things we do in church are very wrong.
Sign In or Register to comment.