I personally think that to accuse me of robbing youth of anything is ludicrous and absurd but that is just my opinion.
I also think that what puts a lot of people off from posting on these forums is the way they are always hijacked and turned into …
Dearest Ramez
I was not attempting to respond to any argument or start a discussion. I was merely posting text of something that exists in our church. I love theology although I do not pretend to be a theologian.
Discussion and debate is good and …
I just realised that this Fraction probably is in Fr Tadros' Fraction book as it only hit me when Mina said it but I am sure that is the book Fr Yessa used. Well I am sure that translation will be better so if someone can replace it that would be go…
I don't agree that Fraction prayers are only about the Father or the Son. Yes they all have some sort of link or reference but look at the Fraction of the Apostles Fast it is very much story telling about the lives of Peter and Paul.
This is not a…
Can you post the links for all to access? Luckily I have the books from a monastery in Egypt but it is a question I see a lot. There are 2 books one for Lordly feasts and the other for saint's feasts.
You shouldn't need to convert but you would need to talk to a priest or Bishop for guidance. I'm in a slightly different situation in that my wife is Russian Orthodox and we were married in the Coptic church. She did not convert nor was she baptised…
I did not mean to create an argument on language but those are the instructions they received from the late Pope Shenouda III on ordination. Perhaps I did not make it clear but Metropolitan Seraphim just like Metropolitan Markos (and Bishop Athanasi…
In answer to your questions 1. The Holy Synod decreed some years ago now that between Ascension and Penetecost there is a procession every day in the altar only. I have never seen it documented how many times or should be and most do it 3 times but …
Bishop Athanasius was enthtoned as bishop of the Coptic French Orthodox Church. This is for french converts and he has no authority over any coptic church established by native Egyptians.
Bishop Luka is for the South of France and Geneva where he …
Brilliant response Ramez to which I wholr heartedly agree. My wife is EO orthodox and when attending attending liturgies I often ferl jealous at how systematic and precise tgey are and hope obe day our churxh can be again. I say again as readibg tg…
I think this has been a long standing point of argument in many churches for many years. Having looked through the old Dalal books we have there is mention of a procession with the hymn Evlogymenos with the entrance of the Patriarch, however there i…
In response to the point above we need to be very careful as to what we say are Priest's parts and what are Congregation responses. Any liturgical word used in the church is part of prayer and therefore there is no part more important than the other…
I accept references to one God and the Trinity but what do you mean that we do not use even numbers in our practice? There are many instances throughout the Church year where Kyrie eleison is chanted 10, 12 and 100 times. However in regards to Proce…
The third version is Alexandrian and if I were to describe it then I would say it is a hymn of very random hezaat and not systematic or repetitive at all. I think someone would need to contact Fr Moses Samaan for a copy that used to be on coptichymn…
Adding 3 minutes is not necessarily the issue and definitely not crime of the century but it can lead to opened floodgates and then who decides where the line should be drawn?
In regards to Muallim Ibrahim chanting both tunes as a way of declaring…
I agree in the case of Ti-shori it is more an alternative tune (although still slightly longer) but the principle remains that different versions of hymns should not be needlessly repeated after each other in the same service. Mu'allim Ibrahim does …
As I say to me it just does not make sense. Can you imagine how long our church services would be if every hymn was chanted in its known long and shorter tune? I could not in all honesty say I could agree and still see it as unnecessary repetition a…
I think there is a big difference between chanting a hymn in different languages and chanting a hymn in the same language in two different tunes in the same service. I really do love our coptic language and hymns and in the past may have thought not…
I would seriously doubt if anyone does this. Generally speaking when a hymn has varying tunes then a church decides which one to chant but I do not believe the practice of chanting a hymn in all its known ways is recommended as it makes services unn…
There are two arguments for use of cymbals and both different schools of thought. The modern argument is they are to set rhythm and therefore can be used at any time and the more traditional teaching is that cymbals add an element of joy and should …
I think in your ignorance you make swift assumptions. I do not learn from either Gad Louis or Ibrahim Ayad and know for a fact they make mistakes, just like any human does. However I do know them personally and have great admiration for their knowle…
I don't think we can say that with all certainty. It is a fair assumption but not necessarily fact. Again we have the point that Wagsy recorded all verses in the annual mohayar and not the sociology tune.
Interestingly while I was at church this evening I looked at our old Dalal book from the early 1900s, so before any of the Deacons service books, and it simply states to be chanted in the annual tune. There is no mention of what the annual tune is n…
I think you are not going to convince us that they are wrong and likewise you are not going to be convinced that there are two tunes to the hymn. Who knows back in the day it may of even had its own specific tune that was lost, we will never know.
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Personally I cannot understand the argument. There are sources that say the hymn can be chanted in the tune of Pioik or the doxology tune therefore the choice is of the cantor? However neither is incorrect. Clearly cantors such as Ibrahim Ayad and G…
I do not know of any specific Batos communion hymns. However the annual communion is
1. Psalm 150
2 Ekesmarouot
3. Pioik
4. Praise / Madi7a (following the quick doxology tune)
This is seven days a week during annual times. While I respect Wagdi Bis…
I think it is safe to conclude that the hymn of Lazarus can be chanted in the tune of Pioik or like the doxology/madi7a tune. I know I have heard recordings of both ways but cantors such as Muallim Faheem. I personally would consider Pioik a 'hymn' …