Adam and Eve

edited December 1969 in Coptic Orthodox Church
I recently got into a bit of a debate with my religion teacher ( who just happens to be a Ukrainian Catholic priest ) over Adam and Eve, he claimed that the story didn’t actually happen while I tried to explain to him that it’s a true story that actually took place not just a parable or anything like that. Unfortunately being weak in understanding my faith didn’t exactly help me while debating with him. Nothing would please me more then to show him and the class the correct teachings and prove it to them. So how can I prove it to him?

   I tried to explain to him that in the book of Luke 3:23-38 it shows Jesus’s ancestors all the way down to Adam, so just as Jesus and Joseph etc. were true people so was Adam. Therefore it would prove the creation story true but he’s studied Hebrew for many years and told me that the word Adam in Hebrew means those of the earth or earthlings so if someone were reading it at the time they’d physically be saying “...the son of Seth, the son of the earthlings, the son of God.”

   So now im stuck, I know what I believe in and that’s not going to change but I know someone out their can give me a leg up and show me ways I can prove the issue of Adam and Eve to him and the class. I really can’t just sit their in class and listen to blasphemy I want to speak out.

   He also tried to disprove the creation by telling me to look at the first and second creation stories and realize that they both contradict each other because their in different orders. So If anyone can help me out their I’d really appreciate it the sooner the better.

   By the way if this topic has already been discussed then just kindly give me the link or summarize some points here, Thank You.


  • i go to a catholic school, and not only the story of adam and eve do they say didnt happen, but also the whole old tstament!!!!!!! my friends teacher also said God could be a gurl. how stupid!
  • Allen, this has happened to me before when I was in gr.9…my Catholic teacher was denying things in the Bible, specifically the story of Moses (bits and pieces of it) but at the time I was afraid Id say something incorrect about the faith so I always kept quiet when she started talking… anyways, this is what I always tell people now if they believe that some stories in the Bible are parables, as you said….

    #1) They cannot pick and choose their beliefs: they cant just say, “I don’t want to believe in this story…” and a couple of verses down they say, “that sounds real, I’m believing it”… and regardless of what the Hebrew language says, they either believe in the Bible or they don’t… after all, this is faith we’re dealing with, its not a side order at McD’s …if your teacher is Catholic, I presume he believes in the Creation story, then why would he believe that God made the Heaven, the earth, the seas, the stars, etc…and not believe that Adam was created from the dust of the earth?;

    2) As you said yourself in Luke 3:23-38: there’s an entire excerpt on the genealogy of Christ. And you’re RIGHT, your answer was absolutely right! Who was Luke’s audience? The Gentiles! Who were they? NON-Jews! And that’s exactly why he used Adam in the end of his genealogy, to show that everyone is part of one large connected family despite their differences…remember, Non-Jews and Jews were definately not the groups to mingle at the time, so to mention a Jew, and especially, ADAM, the FIRST CREATION, this means a lot….its not symbolic for that matter;

    3) Adam’s name means Human: yes, because he was fully HUMAN, he was born directly from dust; he brought sin into the world. When Luke says the Son of Adam…yea Adam’s name means Humanity, but within the context of this passage, that interpretation does not serve its purpose….First off, Luke was speaking to the Gentiles, so why would he use a language different from their own? Why would Luke speak symbolically to the Gentiles in Hebrew if he wants to get his point across! And if your teacher says this, and im sure he will, that the Jews and Non-Jews knew the other’s language, so of course the Gentiles would understand, then tell your teacher this: “If I’m speaking to a younger audience and I’m a scientist working on a master project, would I talk to them in a scientific and abstract way?! NO! Why? Because you lose your audience! You can’t start throwing in a diff language to an audience that doesn’t speak it…you wanna have your audience rapt in your words…that just doesn’t make sense what your teacher is saying;

    4) Finally, and I hope I didn’t bore you but 'WHY should ADAM’s name mean something and not seth, nor Enosh, nor obed nor peleg?!!' Seth means granted…how come SETH wasn’t interpreted differently?! Maybe if none of the above methods work you should ask ur teacher that question to throw him off.


    1 Timothy 1

    3 …so that you may command certain men not to teach false doctrines any longer 4 nor to devote themselves to myths and endless genealogies. These promote controversies rather than God's work–which is by faith. 5The goal of this command is love, which comes from a pure heart and a good conscience and a sincere faith. 6 Some have wandered away from these and turned to meaningless talk. 7 They want to be teachers of the law, but they do not know what they are talking about or what they so confidently affirm.
  • God Bless you Youstina S :), thanks for the great reply. If anyone else has something else to add it would be greatly appreciated. ;D
  • my friends teacher also said God could be a gurl

    That teacher must have been watching way too much dogma. LOL
  • my friends teacher also said God could be a gurl.

    ^ actually, my gr.10 religion teacher said the same thing :o
  • my friends teacher also said God could be a gurl.

    Is it just me or when students/ teachers say stuff like that you just imidiatly jump into the conversation and correct them and try and tell them the right teaching even if you don't know much about what your talking about?

    We need to better prepair ourselves so that we dont have to go back and figure out our information, we should be ready on the spot to defend our faith. Sometimes I feel so bad when I know the correct teaching but cant prove it to someone.

    If anyone can add to my original question that'd be great. :)
  • You're right Allen...i was faced MANY times with those situations and b/c i didnt have good enough knowledge back then about my faith i never knew how to defend my faith in heated discussions, even if i knew the truth deep down inside

    And you're aboslutely right, we should have more knowledge about our faith before we talk, but remember that even if you try defening your faith and still cannot convince those around you because of your weak arguements, you did what you could do to the best of your abilities and God will be content

    "yet in the church I would rather speak five words with my understanding, that I may teach others also, than ten thousand words in a tongue." 1 Corinthians 14:19
  • Not to mention that even if we did have a better understanding of our faith their are always some people that will never accept new things or ideas no matter how correct they are.

    A Wise Man Once Said : Avoid those who prefer conflict in discussion
  • i Go to a catholic school, the same one as yoshi and i must commend her on her great responce to this thread, and all the other threads (by the way who was ur religion teacher yoshi??) anyways back to the topic at hand, your right we absoultly must be prepared to field such ridiculus claims as these, i once Got into a disscusion with my chaplin, on the creation story, they believe in tow creation storys, but they consider one of them a myth, which is bougus and contradictory and makes no sense whatsoever. For starters, how do they explain the creation of man, if they dont believe in the adam and eve creation story?? and where did the Jews first see the idea of salvation from sin?? hello genisis 3:15 that was all adam and eve! i am almost certain that the catholic church does not see darwins theory of evelotion as the creation story! tell your teacher that once he can acctually back up his claims with some acctual logical arguments, that he shouldnt even be disscusing things like this.

    The worst thing is when a teacher takes it upon themselves to interpret the bible, and tell students the wrong thing, i had a teach tell me once that moses didnt part the red sea and that the jews just walked through shallow water! what is that?? let me tell you something most catholics dont even know that they think the adam and eve story is a myth cause most catholics dont know what they believe they are so confused.

    I am not trying to bad mouth catholics or anything cause they are great people, but if they are going to make claims like a fake creation story, why dont they back it up with some good arguments cause the things i hear are just plain nothing.

    I asked my friend the other day about purgatory and let me tell you, that makes no sense, and she doesnt even know why she believes in purgatory just that it is nessesssary for entrance into heaven! so sad! anyways i know that didnt help much, but good luck with your debate. Ask God for guidance and he will put the words in your mouth trust me.

  • Hi Allen:
    The only One credible that we must trust is Our Lord Jesus Christ.
    Our Lord, Himself mentioned the story of creation in the Gosple of St. Mathew chapter 19 and St. Mark chapter 10 :2. At the same time He quoted from the Book of Genesis chapter 2 verse 24 because He is the same One who was talking to Adam& Eve and officiating their marriage. Regarding chapter 1 & 2 differance:
    Chapter 1 was talking about the story of creation in generals, including the creation of the first man, and chapter 2 in specific, extracting the creation of man and talking about it in details eg. giving them names; forming a woman from Adam and marrying them.
  • Sum kid in my class goes when its raining God is crying n when it thunders Gods bowling and my religion teacher (same as yoshis n maria) said " Yea that could be true too". Basically I think the problem with Catholics (not all id hafta add or ill get attack by ppl on the site) is that theyve been so exposed to this whole SUBJECTIVISM thing.... EVERYTHING IS SUBJECTIVE.... nothing is concrete... everything is watever u want it to be, however u see it which is simply not tru. Anyways, id like to end this by saying God BlesS OUR MOTHER THE COPTIC CHURCH... seriously.... without her we'd prolly be just as lost...
  • Copt4life, Amen to that!!!
    You see, the problem (one of many) with the catholic church is they went thru that phase that said "No one can understand the Bible, so NO ONE is allowed to read or interpret the Bible". And we see the error of thier ways everyday when we see a protestant or baptist church.
    Now that they realized thier problem, they take the other extreme, You put God into the frame that you create for Him. So God has to fit into my life and beliefs. They just can't be moderate or accept God for who He truely is.
    Just my 2 cents.
  • You guys are right.. It just takes faith to believe what you read. As Coptic Orthodox Christains, as HG Bishop Moussa says, we take the Bible literally. Not parts like "if your eye causes you to sin pluck it out.." but just generally with the stories and such. God bless.
  • guys i went to catholic school i understand they do many things different then us they believe in purigatory we don't , we use the st.james version bible they use st.joseph many differences that is why we are orthodox and they are catholic. but we shouldn't really argue with them instead show them the orthodox faith i remember my sunday school teacher said once that the bible is useless if all we do is read it and not put it in use as to actually doing the action, guys get what i'm saying ;D

  • all christain faiths catholic,protestant,baptist,lutherin, orthodox
    all of us have at least one thing in common WE ALL BEIEVE that Jesus Christ is GOD
    right so i mean argueing with them and saying what you guys believe is wrong ect....
    isn't really the right way to go think about it if somebody told me that what i believe is wrong i would pop them in the face(lol that was a joke i would just get mad ;D) but for real its much kinder and meanigful to show them with actions rather then argueing or telling them
  • your right, i truly believe that argueing would not help the situation. People learn through understanding, not heated debates. We are all Christians, we all believe in our lord Jesus Christ, that he is our God and savior. That is all that matters. I got into a dissucion at school with an atheist, he always tried to get a logic answer, i knew i wasn't gonna get through to him. I did my best explaining but he wasn't having it. So finally i said, that is why we believe without questions, its called faith. we don't need answers for everything, its God's will. Thy will be done. Just know in the end that everyone's faith will be tested, and thats just a slight start to it. If someone isn't sure about a certain topic, just go to your parents or the priest(abona) and their will be an explanation. Just have faith, and pray.
    hope that helped. pray for me for i am a sinner. God Bless and Happy Palm Sunday.
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