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Salvation for non-christians?

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  • minasolimanminasoliman
    edited July 2017
    Neither am I ophadece.  Even when I read these sources, I cannot come to any other conclusion than say "I do not know anything".  My main issue is not convince people to do anything else but to keep the afterlife a mystery without presuming to say who we should or should not pray for.

    And if our Coptic prayers have always offered some hope for those in Amente, we should have never changed that or removed that, even if we can't fully understand what that means.
  • ophadeceophadece
    Dear @minasoliman,
    Very well said. May God bless us all and grant us the forgiveness of our sins we do knowingly or unknowingly in preparation for that day we will be scrutinised before Him. As @Remnkemi said it is unwise to think of others' salvation and forget one's own; we should strive to look at ours and be an example to others, leading a life in obedience to God in all aspects. 
    Oujai qen `P[c
  • mikeforjesusmikeforjesus
    ophadece said:

    Dear @minasoliman,

    Agreed on all what you said. However, efficacy doesn't mean the bad will gain forgiveness when we pray for them (UNLESS GOD LISTENS TO THOSE PRAYERS AND CHANGES HIS HEART). Likewise, people who died in sin, may still be forgiven even though the church would refuse to pray for them. I will read your article now.
    Oujai qen P[c
    We do not change God's heart. He does not change. If God chooses to change His mind it is up to Him but not up to us but it is not likely because His feelings towards others are right
    The bible says who has become God counsellor. God is sure about His feelings towards the unrepentant but He is willing to hear anyone prayer for them as He did with Abraham. Their prayer is just for Him to show Himself merciful and just but He knows what to do
  • mikeforjesusmikeforjesus
    edited July 2017
    ophadece said:

    No @mikeforjesus,

    There is no suffering for the chosen. It is EITHER OR. Either you enter the heavenly Kingdom (having awaited in paradise), or the eternal fire (having awaited in hades). There is no suffering at all, because YOU HAVE TO BE SURE that Christ's blood cleanses and purifies us WHOLLY, despite our iniquities, incompleteness, and imperfections in offering true repentance. No one is capable of doing that, but that doesn't mean that the whole humanity will suffer a little, or much, before entering the heavenly Kingdom. NO. Christ's blood is infinite. While you say you don't believe in purgatory, what this describes is some form of purgatory. That is wrong. 

    Another point as you rightly say, partaking of the Holy Communion is a must for forgiveness of our sins. This distinguishes us from other denominations, e.g. protestants. 

    Oujai qen P[c

    I personally don't believe it but it is a tradition not found in the bible but not rejected by the bible either as far as I am aware but some type of prayer for the dead is found in deuterocanonical book 2 Maccabees. Maybe I should say we are fully cleansed of our sins and washed but we need to be disciplined to not learn sin again and be unclean again. But I suppose I taught in that post some minor sins you can die in and this is wrong and where the catholic teaching may fail if they teach that.
    You may not overcome it but you must not die in it you need to be forgiven and cleansed. You have to confess it and feel contrite about it. The wise virgins can not give oil to the foolish especially those who they are not obliged to which seems or probably none are they obliged to. All the grace they deserve is got before death. More to those who deserve more
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