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Cameras during communion
What's the deal?
Bishop David told us to turn the camera in the alter (we broadcast our liturgies) around while he took communion.
Is there an actual explanation to this?
[coptic]-dolab[/coptic]
Bishop David told us to turn the camera in the alter (we broadcast our liturgies) around while he took communion.
Is there an actual explanation to this?
[coptic]-dolab[/coptic]
Comments
What's the deal?
Bishop David told us to turn the camera in the alter (we broadcast our liturgies) around while he took communion.
Is there an actual explanation to this?
[coptic]-dolab[/coptic]
yeah.....at that time, the Mysteries are as clear as ever during the liturgy so it's recommended to not be recorded on cameras.....we stop our videos broadcasting sundays just when communion starts or just not get communion inside.
In Christ
Theophilus
in all technicality, there should NOT be any recording or picture taking of the liturgy starting from when we say the Creed! or even people that are not going to take communion, they should not be present!
this is a Mystery, and we broadcast it for everyone to see?! THE BODY OF MY SAVIOR will be on tv, while I sit laying down, or even sitting down... and then not partake of Him?! they do broadcast in my church... and I help them... but when it comes to a liturgy, I've never held a camera, and will never allow myself to do that...
neshkor Allah, akhadna el baraka
Your reply is very brave and correct. Yet, you will get much opinion to the contrary.
Get ready for the backlash.
Superman BAM,
Your reply is very brave and correct. Yet, you will get much opinion to the contrary.
Get ready for the backlash.
well....i agree to some certain extant....but i don't think there will be much backlash.....not much people care and they shouldn't. the only people who should are those who can't get to a church where, living in a far place from one, the closest they have to a liturgy is the tv/computer screen.
Why do I say this?! because here on tasbeha.org/copticchurch.net, we were the first (not being there when it started) to start video broadcasting on the internet.....and as i believe, and the testimony of many, we are still the best at it :-).
I knew the broadcast from the Cathedral and all that stuff was coming. I still agree with you.
Hang in there my man.
as jydeacon and yousiegtennis mentioned, in the liturgy of the catechumens, the people who were not christian were asked to leave after the litanies, because they have heard the reading and learned what is to be taught... but as WE the CHURCH say the Creed, we ARE ONE IN UNITY PROCLAIMING THE FAITH... when we say He rose, WE ARE ONE IN UNITY PROCLAIMING, "YOUR DEATH OH LORD WE PROCLAIM, OF YOUR HOLY RESURRECTION AND ASCENSION TO THE HEAVENS WE CONFESS"
THIS IS THE HOLY OF HOLLIES!!! who enters and views the HOLY OF HOLLIES?! only the priest in the old testament, and those who are in the levels of Priesthood in the church! so with the camera we allow, Christian Coptic... Christian Protestant, and all Christian denominations, we allow Muslims, we allow Jews, we allow anybody, no matter who it is to watch and see our mystery, is He that cheap for us to have Him be a show for whoever?!
I will go ahead and give you what the Apostle said in the DIDASCALIA about this matter, to prove to you that only Christians need to be there, and only Christians in union!
"When thou callest an assembly of the Church as one that is the commander of a great ship, appoint the
assemblies to be made with all possible skill, charging the deacons as mariners to prepare places for the
brethren as for passengers, with all due care and decency. And first, let the building be long, with its
head to the east, with its vestries on both sides at the east end, and so it will be like a ship. In the middle
let the bishop's throne be placed, and on each side of him let the presbytery sit down; and let the deacons
stand near at hand, in close and small girt garments, for they are like the mariners and managers of the
ship: with regard to these, let the laity sit on the other side, with all quietness and good order. And let the
women sit by themselves, they also keeping silence. In the middle, let the reader stand upon some high
place: let him read the books of Moses, of Joshua the son of Nun, of the Judges, and of the Kings and of
the Chronicles, and those written after the return from the captivity; and besides these, the books of Job
and of Solomon, and of the sixteen prophets. But when there have been two lessons severally read, let
some other person sing the hymns of David, and let the people join at the conclusions of the verses.
Afterwards let our Acts be read, and the Epistles of Paul our fellow-worker, which he sent to the
churches under the conduct of the Holy Spirit; and afterwards let a deacon or a presbyter read the
Gospels, both those which I Matthew and John have delivered to you, and those which the fellowworkers
of Paul received and left to you, Luke and Mark. And while the Gospel is read, let all the
presbyters and deacons, and all the people, stand up in great silence; for it is written: "Be silent, and
hear, O Israel." And again: "But do thou stand there, and hear." In the next place, let the presbyters
one by one, not all together, exhort the people, and the bishop in the last place, as being the commander.
Let the porters stand at the entries of the men, and observe them. Let the deaconesses also stand at those
of the women, like shipmen. For the same description and pattern was both in the tabernacle of the
testimony and in the temple of God.
But if any one be found sitting out of his place, let him be rebuked by the deacon, as a manager of the foreship, and be removed into the place proper for him; for the Church is not only like a ship, but also like a sheepfold. For as the shepherds place all the brute creatures distinctly, I mean goats and sheep, according to their kind and age, and still every one runs together, like to his like; so is it to be in the Church. Let the young persons sit by themselves, if there be
a place for them; if not, let them stand upright. But let those that are already stricken in years sit in order.
For the children which stand, let their fathers and mothers take them to them. Let the younger women
also sit by themselves, if there be a place for them; but if there be not, let them stand behind the women.
Let those women which are married, and have children, be placed by themselves; but let the virgins, and
the widows, and the elder women, stand or sit before all the rest; and let the deacon be the disposer of
the places, that every one of those that comes in may go to his proper place, and may not sit at the
entrance. In like manner, let the deacon oversee the people, that nobody may whisper, nor slumber, nor
laugh, nor nod; for all ought in the church to stand wisely, and soberly, and attentively, having their
attention fixed upon the word of the Lord. After this, let all rise up with one consent, and looking
towards the east, after the catechumens and penitents are gone out, pray to God eastward, who ascended
up to the heaven of heavens to the east; remembering also the ancient situation of paradise in the east,
from whence the first man, when he had yielded to the persuasion of the serpent, and disobeyed the
command of God, was expelled. As to the deacons, after the prayer is over, let some of them attend upon
the oblation of the Eucharist, ministering to the Lord's body with fear. Let others of them watch the
multitude, and keep them silent. But let that deacon who is at the high priest's hand say to the people,
Let no one have any quarrel against another; let no one come in hypocrisy. Then let the men give the
men, and the women give the women, the Lord's kiss. But let no one do it with deceit, as Judas betrayed
the Lord with a kiss.
After this let the deacon pray for the whole Church, for the whole world, and the
several parts of it, and the fruits of it; for the priests and the rulers, for the high priest and the king, and
the peace of the universe. After this let the high priest pray for peace upon the people, and bless them, as
Moses commanded the priests to bless the people, in these words: "The Lord bless thee, and keep thee:
the Lord make His face to shine upon thee, and give thee peace." Let the bishop pray for the
people, and say: "Save Thy people, O Lord, and bless Thine inheritance, which Thou hast obtained with
the precious blood of Thy Christ, and hast called a royal priesthood, and an holy nation." After this let
the sacrifice follow, the people standing, and praying silently; and when the oblation has been made, let
every rank by itself partake of the Lord's body and precious blood in order, and approach with reverence
and holy fear, as to the body of their king. Let the women approach with their heads covered, as is
becoming the order of women; but let the door be watched, lest any unbeliever, or one not yet initiated,
come in."
you wanted a backup to my statement here is one (sorry I put the whole thing, I thought everyone should read this), and here is another, and if you read the whole thing, this is when the deacon says offer offer offer in order... but here you go!
"And I James, the brother of John, the son of Zebedee, say, that the deacon shall immediately say,
Let none of the catechumens, let none of the hearers, let none of the unbelievers, let none of the
heterodox, stay here. You who have prayed the foregoing prayer, depart. Let the mothers receive their
children; let no one have anything against any one; let no one come in hypocrisy; let us stand upright
before the Lord with fear and trembling, to offer. When this is done, let the deacons bring the gifts to the
bishop at the altar; and let the presbyters stand on his right hand, and on his left, as disciples stand
before their Master. But let two of the deacons, on each side of the altar, hold a fan, made up of thin
membranes, or of the feathers of the peacock, or of fine cloth, and let them silently drive away the small
animals that fly about, that they may not come near to the cups. Let the high priest, therefore, together
with the priests, pray by himself; and let him put on his shining garment, and stand at the altar, and
make the sign of the cross upon his forehead with his hand, and say: The grace of Almighty God, and
the love of our Lord Jesus Christ, and the fellowship of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. And let all with
one voice say: And with thy spirit. The high priest: Lift up your mind. All the people: We lift it up unto
the Lord. The high priest: Let us give thanks to the Lord. All the people: It is meet and right so to do.
Then let the high priest say: It is very meet and fight before all things to sing an hymn to Thee, who art
the true God, who art before all beings, "from whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named; "
who only art unbegotten, and without beginning, and without a ruler, and without a master; who standest
in need of nothing; who art the bestower of everything that is good; who art beyond all cause and
generation; who art alway and immutably the same; from whom all things came into being, as from their
proper original. For Thou art eternal knowledge, everlasting sight, unbegotten hearing, untaught
wisdom, the first by nature, and the measure of being, and beyond all number; who didst bring all things
out of nothing into being by Thy only begotten Son, but didst beget Him before all ages by Thy will,
Thy power, and Thy goodness, without any instrument, the only begotten Son, God the Word, the living
Wisdom..."
by recording the liturgy, you are giving the ability for everyone to view it... and only as the teaching of the apostles the Christians who are in union are to be present!
but hey, again this is only the teaching of the apostles... what do they know, right?!
Akhadna el baraka... neshkor Allah!
How about standing in the face of the priest during the Liturgy, as a total distraction, and 'flash' him in the eyes as he is trying to pray and literally speak to the Almighty?
Can anyone really concentrate with the roving photographer and videographer?
Can the photographer or videographer actually pray? Was their purpose in coming to the church to participate and receive from the Liturgy or were they coming to get involved with the 'technical aspects'?
Do the angels in Heaven take pictures of God?
Did the iconographers set-up easels in the altar to paint during the liturgy?
What if the cameras are automated? Who runs the cameras? Are they participating in the Liturgy? Are they participating in the road to salvation?
Just questions. Food for thought.
BAM & JY,
The reply to your discourse will be that progress and technology have put a new dynamic in ministry and reaching out to people. That will be the next reply. I just thought I would give you a heads-up.
When you see that cute babe in the close up for a while, is there a method to send in a request for her telephone number?
Should the women, ladies, and girls in the pews have full face veil cover so that they are not videoed in order to keep from their faces and person being used as a source for "other thoughts"? Would that mean that we need burgas for the Liturgy?
I believe the Deacon says: "look towards the east", not lets take a replay on that video feed.
Does it make it comfortable for those in the pews that they are being videoed at a very intimate moment when they are reaching out to God for His Mercy?
BAM & JY,
I'm hoping you cover these points. I'm interested in the replies. I'm net stirring a hornets' nest or anything like that....
I just think that if something is going to be discussed honestly and fully, that all angles have to be covered.
However, I have not really stated where I stand on the issue, I just offer these questions as small possibilities and food for thought. My opinion, really doesn't count. My opinion is really not important.
I'm just looking for answers.
{JOKE}
I wasn't discounting your opinion. I was just curious what the ladies thought about having their faces broadcast and the camera panned on their faces.
Geo,
I wasn't discounting your opinion. I was just curious what the ladies thought about having their faces broadcast and the camera panned on their faces.
well.....if that is what you always see on a broadcast than those who do record need a lot of help. their must be order and specifc when recording live occasions keda.....egy camera men don't really understand it most of the time because most of them don't think when shooting but just shooting.......being not experienced in what they're doing.