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Conversation.. Help a Socially Inept (?) person? For the interested..
READ THE BOLD PART IT IS VERY IMPORTANT OR MOST IMPORTANT.. IF YOU WILL NOT READ THE BELOW READ THAT PLEASE AND HELP
I and someone else I know who is dear to me and ofcourse many others have problems just holding a conversation.. I sometimes or very often avoid people completely because I have nothing to talk about.. this issue is like a mountain to overcome possibly.. or a monster... please help me and us and pray for me and us...
I got a number of things from the internet.. its hard to find actual help for this in the internet perhaps.. I suppose this could be because the world and the devil is cruel.. not much or very very few people take the time to really help this problem and teach us to socialise.. about good things .. up to page 24 in google searching
I think most of the world has this problem really.. even those who talk alot.. they just don't know it yet.. tell them to stop talking about junk and they will have little good to say... because we are u'sed to talking junk and thinking junk .. Jesus said out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.. therefore it is because we have not stored good.. it would be good if everyone could always talk spiritual things and enjoy it.. but this is not so.. and it seems likely that there is a lot of normal things to talk about that is not sin... if we can use our brains to make movies like shrek, the bee movie and video games that are so graphical (Well I can't perhaps but others can ).. how can we not use our brains for one of the most important parts of our life.. socialising to others and showing your love to the children of God and the world... the bible says.. Greet EVERY saint in Christ Jesus (I guess it meant believer).. I hardly greet any.. and we will never have assurance of eternal life if we do not love everyone.. and if we are called to live a life in the world then we will need to atleast be able to start friendships and keep them for a while that we may be able to sacrifice some of ourselves for other people and to do it joyfully for God loves a cheerful giver.. even the monks.. they have to live a communal life first right? it helps to discover their own personal faults.. and to have humility before one another.. and I do not think it is even right then sometimes to always talk spiritual things.. because you have to get the sense that we are all still human or normal right? (this does not mean you should reject a person who is always talking spiritual things but you should teach him to talk about normal things and enlighten his eyes to good things in the world)
besides if you are always giving spiritual advice perhaps you will err sometimes or alot... but I think for monks its much different?
.. the bible says "he who can control his tongue is a perfect man and can control his entire nature" right?
therefore you must take a vow of silence (or be mostly silent) or you must have alot of good things to talk about.. try to grow up remembering good things to talk about that give real joy to people who you talk to (like making people know that they are more interesting than they thought or they could be.. or talking about the obvious things that interest people which is not sinful). remember the good things other people spoke about.. unfortunately I never remember the good things I talked about when I u'sed to socialise.. perhaps and I think others do not either.. is it true.. use your brain or lose it?
even pope shenouda says one stragedy to fight the devil is talk to another person about something... so he doesn't pray all the time?
and there was some innocent feasting in the old testament right? and job allowed his sons and daughters in their youth to go to each other's houses and socialise and enjoy each other's company right? maybe they had guests too..
............
I MIGHT BE WRONG... If you avoid silence alot though then you will not be able to pray and build your spirit in other ways
pope shenouda also said that the devil provokes you to quickness of joy.. so that you lose a contrite heart.. search for the word joy.. in life of repentance and purity.. I don't know what he meant.. perhaps sinful joy he means...
but they said of abba john or someone else his mind was always on heavenly things... some monks (?) tried to test him (?) and talk about something earthly which does not seem like a sin.. and he would turn it into something spiritutal.. does this mean it is wrong to talk about normal (?) things.. or perhaps only for monks or some monks...
the bible said there is a time to keep silent and a time to speak.. I don't know when is this time to speak.. but I am afraid when I am hold I will feel I was deluded and missed out on a lot of good experiences.. and missed out on understanding some important lessons about how the world really is or people.. but maybe I will be safe living in the world never speaking to noone.. I do enjoy my God when I want to.. or I could think about nothing but that is miserable so I will be tempted by the devil.. but we have the ability to enjoy God as much as we want ( we can read the bible for 3 hours if we want).. who of us meditates on the LORD of the LORD day and night always.. if you take giant leaps you will suffer badly though pope shenouda says and I suppose your FOC ofcourse has this in mind.. but when we are tempted to sin we do not want to read the bible.. but this is when we should read it most..
Or perhaps noone really wants to talk about normal things (?) and they want to talk about spiritual things? what do you think? are those people who want to talk about normal things alot.. worth your time? are they just trying to give you a hard time if you fail and try to reject you.. if you can not measure up? is it really all about proving you are able to socialise (while I do not trust I will learn to socialise properly with many people anyway)? are they there so that you can be tempted to sin when you feel low and rejected? because they are not even trying to build a good friendship with you anyway..
I was going to say something very long related to this but I chose not to .. thought it would be wise not.. if you want to hear it you can say so..
you know I can look at everyone speaking and not know at all what they are saying..... I think I am hurting them too much by doing this (am I humiliating them? am I the most piercing judgmental arrogant person out there) and so I avoid people.. I think this is because I got into a habit of not even hearing bad stuff people are saying.. or because I got into a habit about thinking alot on my own and trying to overcome evil thoughts.. which seems weird sometimes.. but when I thought about this painful experience I think it might actually by God's will for me to stay with people.. even if I do not know what they are saying and I am giving devlish vibes? It was not the devil speaking this to me right? I actually might HATE people or am AFRAID of their nature who live in denial and pretend they are at peace with me when they are not.. but maybe it is wise for them to bear with me in peace.. hoping I will improve.. being longsuffering towards me.. hopefully this is wise and I won't tear their whole person down or self esteem.. hopefully they are not encouraging me to be arrogant or encouraging me to ruin my own person and heart by doing this.. one other thing that torments me .. is I feel like I should not make a single body movement in public sometimes .. I think it reveals sometimes an extreme scary sexual impulse.. and I analyse my bodily movements.. like when I have to wait in a line where there are girls I do not want to take a single step sometimes and when I do I look worse than other people... this has been happening for a long time.. for the same reason I do not play some sports.. It could be because of some of my sins... I insist every pretty girl surely it is God's will to beware... or girl with good form.. huh sometimes I think I saw a girl and walk rapidly when it was really just a guy .. huh maybe an old man.. crazy mind.. anyway to some people there is no need to walk rapidly if there is a girl anyway and they are fine..
I BEG YOU to add many other things to talk about (from the list below) from your own experience or whatever... or from finding good stuff from good sites on the internet.. maybe we can fill this post to many threads long... and once we can socialise well for say 3 months maybe we will all improve on our own and find our own things to talk about.. the level of comfort created with those you were successful with may help you talk more freely about other things and by knowing a person and caring about their happiness you will find things to talk about that you think another person will enjoy talking about and learning about even if that person does not about that thing yet.. perhaps you can make a person interested in something you think he/she will like like and you will be able to be creative to make your friend happy.. so how we were in childhood right?
I usually start with the most basic questions about age, living conditions, relatives, where they grew up, etc. After I have collected that batch of monosyllabic answers, I crank it up a notch and start asking them questions about their personal interests. I ask what their schedule is and which is their favorite class. I ask about hobbies, travel, outside of school experiences. I ask about pets, friends, relatives and work. I ask and ask and ask until the kid has become used to talking. Then I move into the really important questions.
(I DID NOT SAY THIS PARAGRAPH SOMEONE ELSE DID WHO IS GIVING ADVICE TO SOMEONE WANTING TO MAKE FRIENDS OR SOMETHING)
Clothes & Fashion
Earthquakes
Fears
Family .. how many cousins
Gardening
What were some of the most interesting things you have done in your life.
What do you think is interesting about your culture?
Have you ever felt confused by the actions of someone from another culture?
* If so, tell me about it.
If aliens visited your country, what might surprise them?
Talk about many experiences... such as my visit to canada.. when I learned whistling.. think of other experiences..
Favourite subject in school..
Ask if they have ever touched a snake or rode a horse..
# Have you ever eaten frogs' legs?
Have you ever been on TV?
Have you ever seen a car accident? I hope you never do
Have you ever slept in a tent?
Are you excited about this course?
shopping.. what are some of the best things you have bought?
How did your parents choose your name? What did they tell you?
A new street in your neighbourhood is due to open shortly. What name would you like to give it? Why?
Your pets and the things you like about them
Favorite dinner foods
Favorite breakfast foods
Favorite lunch foods
Favorite junk foods
Have you ever had a dream where you were flying or you fell off a cliff?
Favourite cartoons.. do you like the flinstones or jestsons?
Tell about your brothers, sisters, cousins, etc.
Where you'd travel if you could go anywhere
What is one of the best movies you have seen that had a good lesson to be learned?
Do you think the Segway encourages laziness?
Talk about the news
Do you play any sports.. which sport are you best at? Which is your favourite and why?
Have you got your driver's licence/ are you on your L/P plates?
Do you like bush walking?
Your favorite kind of books to read--best authors and why
Ended at Page 24 When searching "conversation topics" in google
So long my friends.. may God make you forget everything I said if it will cause trauma in your life.. I did not know such arrogance or whatever exists in a person..
I salutation with my own hands my friends.. (Haha I did not even write a letter of love to you.. )
I and someone else I know who is dear to me and ofcourse many others have problems just holding a conversation.. I sometimes or very often avoid people completely because I have nothing to talk about.. this issue is like a mountain to overcome possibly.. or a monster... please help me and us and pray for me and us...
I got a number of things from the internet.. its hard to find actual help for this in the internet perhaps.. I suppose this could be because the world and the devil is cruel.. not much or very very few people take the time to really help this problem and teach us to socialise.. about good things .. up to page 24 in google searching
I think most of the world has this problem really.. even those who talk alot.. they just don't know it yet.. tell them to stop talking about junk and they will have little good to say... because we are u'sed to talking junk and thinking junk .. Jesus said out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.. therefore it is because we have not stored good.. it would be good if everyone could always talk spiritual things and enjoy it.. but this is not so.. and it seems likely that there is a lot of normal things to talk about that is not sin... if we can use our brains to make movies like shrek, the bee movie and video games that are so graphical (Well I can't perhaps but others can ).. how can we not use our brains for one of the most important parts of our life.. socialising to others and showing your love to the children of God and the world... the bible says.. Greet EVERY saint in Christ Jesus (I guess it meant believer).. I hardly greet any.. and we will never have assurance of eternal life if we do not love everyone.. and if we are called to live a life in the world then we will need to atleast be able to start friendships and keep them for a while that we may be able to sacrifice some of ourselves for other people and to do it joyfully for God loves a cheerful giver.. even the monks.. they have to live a communal life first right? it helps to discover their own personal faults.. and to have humility before one another.. and I do not think it is even right then sometimes to always talk spiritual things.. because you have to get the sense that we are all still human or normal right? (this does not mean you should reject a person who is always talking spiritual things but you should teach him to talk about normal things and enlighten his eyes to good things in the world)
besides if you are always giving spiritual advice perhaps you will err sometimes or alot... but I think for monks its much different?
.. the bible says "he who can control his tongue is a perfect man and can control his entire nature" right?
therefore you must take a vow of silence (or be mostly silent) or you must have alot of good things to talk about.. try to grow up remembering good things to talk about that give real joy to people who you talk to (like making people know that they are more interesting than they thought or they could be.. or talking about the obvious things that interest people which is not sinful). remember the good things other people spoke about.. unfortunately I never remember the good things I talked about when I u'sed to socialise.. perhaps and I think others do not either.. is it true.. use your brain or lose it?
even pope shenouda says one stragedy to fight the devil is talk to another person about something... so he doesn't pray all the time?
and there was some innocent feasting in the old testament right? and job allowed his sons and daughters in their youth to go to each other's houses and socialise and enjoy each other's company right? maybe they had guests too..
............
I MIGHT BE WRONG... If you avoid silence alot though then you will not be able to pray and build your spirit in other ways
pope shenouda also said that the devil provokes you to quickness of joy.. so that you lose a contrite heart.. search for the word joy.. in life of repentance and purity.. I don't know what he meant.. perhaps sinful joy he means...
but they said of abba john or someone else his mind was always on heavenly things... some monks (?) tried to test him (?) and talk about something earthly which does not seem like a sin.. and he would turn it into something spiritutal.. does this mean it is wrong to talk about normal (?) things.. or perhaps only for monks or some monks...
the bible said there is a time to keep silent and a time to speak.. I don't know when is this time to speak.. but I am afraid when I am hold I will feel I was deluded and missed out on a lot of good experiences.. and missed out on understanding some important lessons about how the world really is or people.. but maybe I will be safe living in the world never speaking to noone.. I do enjoy my God when I want to.. or I could think about nothing but that is miserable so I will be tempted by the devil.. but we have the ability to enjoy God as much as we want ( we can read the bible for 3 hours if we want).. who of us meditates on the LORD of the LORD day and night always.. if you take giant leaps you will suffer badly though pope shenouda says and I suppose your FOC ofcourse has this in mind.. but when we are tempted to sin we do not want to read the bible.. but this is when we should read it most..
Or perhaps noone really wants to talk about normal things (?) and they want to talk about spiritual things? what do you think? are those people who want to talk about normal things alot.. worth your time? are they just trying to give you a hard time if you fail and try to reject you.. if you can not measure up? is it really all about proving you are able to socialise (while I do not trust I will learn to socialise properly with many people anyway)? are they there so that you can be tempted to sin when you feel low and rejected? because they are not even trying to build a good friendship with you anyway..
I was going to say something very long related to this but I chose not to .. thought it would be wise not.. if you want to hear it you can say so..
you know I can look at everyone speaking and not know at all what they are saying..... I think I am hurting them too much by doing this (am I humiliating them? am I the most piercing judgmental arrogant person out there) and so I avoid people.. I think this is because I got into a habit of not even hearing bad stuff people are saying.. or because I got into a habit about thinking alot on my own and trying to overcome evil thoughts.. which seems weird sometimes.. but when I thought about this painful experience I think it might actually by God's will for me to stay with people.. even if I do not know what they are saying and I am giving devlish vibes? It was not the devil speaking this to me right? I actually might HATE people or am AFRAID of their nature who live in denial and pretend they are at peace with me when they are not.. but maybe it is wise for them to bear with me in peace.. hoping I will improve.. being longsuffering towards me.. hopefully this is wise and I won't tear their whole person down or self esteem.. hopefully they are not encouraging me to be arrogant or encouraging me to ruin my own person and heart by doing this.. one other thing that torments me .. is I feel like I should not make a single body movement in public sometimes .. I think it reveals sometimes an extreme scary sexual impulse.. and I analyse my bodily movements.. like when I have to wait in a line where there are girls I do not want to take a single step sometimes and when I do I look worse than other people... this has been happening for a long time.. for the same reason I do not play some sports.. It could be because of some of my sins... I insist every pretty girl surely it is God's will to beware... or girl with good form.. huh sometimes I think I saw a girl and walk rapidly when it was really just a guy .. huh maybe an old man.. crazy mind.. anyway to some people there is no need to walk rapidly if there is a girl anyway and they are fine..
I BEG YOU to add many other things to talk about (from the list below) from your own experience or whatever... or from finding good stuff from good sites on the internet.. maybe we can fill this post to many threads long... and once we can socialise well for say 3 months maybe we will all improve on our own and find our own things to talk about.. the level of comfort created with those you were successful with may help you talk more freely about other things and by knowing a person and caring about their happiness you will find things to talk about that you think another person will enjoy talking about and learning about even if that person does not about that thing yet.. perhaps you can make a person interested in something you think he/she will like like and you will be able to be creative to make your friend happy.. so how we were in childhood right?
I usually start with the most basic questions about age, living conditions, relatives, where they grew up, etc. After I have collected that batch of monosyllabic answers, I crank it up a notch and start asking them questions about their personal interests. I ask what their schedule is and which is their favorite class. I ask about hobbies, travel, outside of school experiences. I ask about pets, friends, relatives and work. I ask and ask and ask until the kid has become used to talking. Then I move into the really important questions.
(I DID NOT SAY THIS PARAGRAPH SOMEONE ELSE DID WHO IS GIVING ADVICE TO SOMEONE WANTING TO MAKE FRIENDS OR SOMETHING)
Clothes & Fashion
Earthquakes
Fears
Family .. how many cousins
Gardening
What were some of the most interesting things you have done in your life.
What do you think is interesting about your culture?
Have you ever felt confused by the actions of someone from another culture?
* If so, tell me about it.
If aliens visited your country, what might surprise them?
Talk about many experiences... such as my visit to canada.. when I learned whistling.. think of other experiences..
Favourite subject in school..
Ask if they have ever touched a snake or rode a horse..
# Have you ever eaten frogs' legs?
Have you ever been on TV?
Have you ever seen a car accident? I hope you never do
Have you ever slept in a tent?
Are you excited about this course?
shopping.. what are some of the best things you have bought?
How did your parents choose your name? What did they tell you?
A new street in your neighbourhood is due to open shortly. What name would you like to give it? Why?
Your pets and the things you like about them
Favorite dinner foods
Favorite breakfast foods
Favorite lunch foods
Favorite junk foods
Have you ever had a dream where you were flying or you fell off a cliff?
Favourite cartoons.. do you like the flinstones or jestsons?
Tell about your brothers, sisters, cousins, etc.
Where you'd travel if you could go anywhere
What is one of the best movies you have seen that had a good lesson to be learned?
Do you think the Segway encourages laziness?
Talk about the news
Do you play any sports.. which sport are you best at? Which is your favourite and why?
Have you got your driver's licence/ are you on your L/P plates?
Do you like bush walking?
Your favorite kind of books to read--best authors and why
Ended at Page 24 When searching "conversation topics" in google
So long my friends.. may God make you forget everything I said if it will cause trauma in your life.. I did not know such arrogance or whatever exists in a person..
I salutation with my own hands my friends.. (Haha I did not even write a letter of love to you.. )
Comments
Can someone write 10000000000 things and then he will win the guiness book of world records.. then perhaps I will respect that book many times over...
first thing i want to say is dont be soo paranoid when u c a girl..i dont really know how u feel i am not a guy..but from being girl..trust me...it is k..we dont bite..lol..i am kidding
no..wat i am trying to say is... it is k if u c a girl..just b/c u c a girl it does not mean that u automatically sinned..u cant help it..it is only a sin if u think about it and ponder and ferment it(the thought) ..u cant help not seeing girls ..or bad things..they r all around u..
as far as not sociallizing..it is perfectly fine if u r silent..as long as u r not judging someone in ur silence .... just praying or speaking with God..that is fine..every1 needs to strive to be like that..and when we open our mouthes..we speak about spiritual things..u actually stated one of my favorite verses " out of the abundance of heart the mouth speaks"...anyways silence is a great virtue..i dont know y u r trying soo hard to loose it..
as far as the list goes..this needs someone absolutly fawdy..sorry i cant do that..got finals!!
pls keep my weakness in ur prayers
-sister in Christ
as far as not sociallizing..it is perfectly fine if u r silent..as long as u r not judging someone in ur silence .... just praying or speaking with God..that is fine..every1 needs to strive to be like that..and when we open our mouthes..we speak about spiritual things..u actually stated one of my favorite verses " out of the abundance of heart the mouth speaks"...anyways silence is a great virtue..i dont know y u r trying soo hard to loose it..
"
Thanks but I do not know...
It was said that a person can talk all day long and not sin and a person can be silent all the time and be sinning much or something like that..
If I do not talk with others even if I am not judging them to hell I do judge them as strangers in some of my heart and dislikable (anyway I do judge sometimes).. I have not got over my affliction of muteness.. infact I think God gave it to me for love of me.. "before I was afflicted I went astray now I keep your word" why did God not give this to all sinners then? Am I the only one worthy of loving the psalms? and having the same spirit? this is the spirit of dejection that was given to the corinth sinner perhaps.. in hope that perhaps my spirit will be saved in the day of the LORD JESUS
but I have not got over it and I believe it is really truly God's will that I am not silent like I am at times.. my priest tells me to talk to all people and he tells me to watch some good stuff on tv.. maybe that was temporarily for a period but perhaps for life..
"I have regretted my past much for speaking but I have never regretted being silent"
-St. Arsenius
When I see everyone like I am in the church and many church servants in western countries and see the youth not able to socialise with one another (and enjoying their life like this) [then goes all the social groups.. all the church sport things and plays etc.. ] then you can tell me not to speak.. and believe they feel the same way as I do..
even then.... I do not know..
not all the sayings from the desert fathers apply to us now.. but perhaps it does apply to me..
I do not believe you can serve others whom you can not talk to.. .. you will never be bold enough to approach someone whom you do not speak to perhaps..
Silence is good. Its a blessing. But its important to know when to be silent and when to talk. I'm like u, I'm very talkative and i guess I should "keep a lid on it" sometimes; but its equally as bad someone who cannot communicate their feelings and stays quiete when expressing themselves would solve MANY issues.
But I can not just come up to someone I just met and talk just like I did now.. infact as comfortable as I am with my parents I would not be able to say all that on the spot perhaps.. to type like that I assume a person has my full attention when people in real life switch off or want to interrupt and I do not want to be someone who is always a burden.. only talks when he wants help right? but never extending friendship.. if I do not have to extend friendship then perhaps thinks are somewhat okay.. besides there are times when two people are anxious or atleast one and someone has to talk.. but normally the talk is not very pleasant to me even if it is not sin.. I don't know.
God Bless!
I realized that people actually are very moody as youth; sometimes preoccupied, and i am a teenager myself.
You will find most people are not as socially ept as they seem.
Anyways, remember the goal is not simply socializing; it is give, take. Why do we talk? To help, to be friendly. Nothing more.
Even if saying something spiritual; to help, if you have imput
please, express it...
Don't worry, smile :) :D
+++
i have worked really hard for the past >30 years to work out how to socialise.
my parents used to tell me 'stop staring at that man' and i would say 'i'm not staring, i'm looking'.
if you make eye contact for more than 1 second at a time, people call it 'staring' and it makes them feel uncomfortable. they think you have seen something funny, for example their trousers are falling down.
lots of things about conversation are about having the right body language. people who understand this without having to learn it, used to say to me to 'just be natural'.
what they didn't know was that what felt natural to me would have looked very strange to them! so i am also not 'natural' when i am socialising and when i am with new people, it takes a lot of energy to do all the right things.
this is how to start a conversation with someone at church or in a group situation.
first, listen. if someone is talking, you should only talk if it's about the same subject. wait they have finished and then say 'i saw that film too' (for example). if you want to talk about something else, wait till it goes quiet.
if no-one is talking, first make eye contact with someone you want to talk to. then look around at other things for at least 3 seconds before trying to make eye contact again. this time you should smile. you can practise in front of a mirror at home, it only needs to be a little smile. this means 'i want to communicate with you'. then you can talk.
people get confused if you walk up to them, say something and then walk away. most people are not very confident and are afraid to communicate with someone who does not follow the normal 'rules' of conversation.
start by asking an 'open' question. ask, for example, 'what did you think of the preaching?' or 'how is your mother' (if you know that person's mother was sick) or 'what are you doing after church?'
if the person gives a short answer, say something short (10 or 20 seconds) that is about the same topic, that is about you, eg 'i like to read matthew 5, it teaches us how to live' (if the sermon was on matthew 5), then ask, 'what do you think?' or how long has she been ill?' (if the mother is ill).
then when the other person has finished talking, leave a silence of at least 5 seconds. maybe that person wants to ask you something, this will give him/her a chance. when someone stops in order to take a breath, this is not when you should start talking. you should wait 5 seconds, they may not have finished.
it's ok not to talk so much while you are learning the rules.
i used to go up to people, and just start talking for 3 or 4 minutes without a break and then feel very sad when they stopped listening! (that was more than 15 years ago). so maybe being quiet is a better option!
i think there are not enough people like us for someone to write a book called 'how to have a conversation'. now that i learned it, i might write it one day when i have time (i am very very busy with work). but i used to get really annoyed that no-one explained it to me. the reason no-one explained it is that their brains work differently and they can't understand our brains enough to explain these things. it's not that they don't want to help, just they really can't help, they don't know how to explain something that is obvious to them.
there is more to write, but a very important thing in conversation is that you should not say everything at once. let someone else speak/write and then save what you have to say for later.
only say it later if it is relevant. so if the topic changes, it is usually better to leave what you want to say and just listen to the other person instead.
but if you want to send me a personal message, you can do it all 'wrong' and i won't mind at all!
may God guide us all and give us patience :)
long ago I bought the book overcoming shyness by blaine smith... and I think it is a good book. Now I am not so shy because I am older and I am sure people like me since they greet me.. however I still have socialising problems.. like I can not make a conversation
BTW thanks for taking an interest in my post
it took a long time, but the hard work was worth it, now i usually like socialising!
id just ask for ppl's msn then take it from there