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Future of Orthodox union

Pharaoh714Pharaoh714
edited December 1969 in Random Issues
I was just wondering is there any future plans to hold meetings with the Eastern Orthodox Churches to further the progress that was achieved in the 1990's?

Any Planed Ecumenical councils/ dates/ anything?

Comments

  • IoannesIoannes
    Not sure, I think we are too busy trying to be protestant at the moment.
  • TITLTITL
    You're too funny Ioannes!  ;D

    I'm not sure how (or why) any tasbeha member would know the answer to this? Maybe Father Peter.. but I think you should ask your local bishop. They have the Pope on speed dial, and he's really the only person that can plan and organize something like this.
  • Pharaoh714Pharaoh714
    Ok thanks for the info.
  • peterfarringtonpeterfarrington
    I have not seen a great deal of progress in the dialogue between the Eastern and Oriental Orthodox communions over the last years. To a great extent this has been because the Churches have been preoccupied with their own internal problems, not the least of which is a hardcore of anti-reconciliationists within the Eastern Orthodox. But there is also the fact that a Russian bishop in some distant place has probably no opportunity of meeting any members of the Oriental Orthodox communion and therefore no urgency in encouraging reconciliation. There is also still a very great ignorance about what we actually believe and so many Eastern Orthodox are concerned that a union could be even considered with those who deny that our Lord Jesus Christ was man.

    On the other hand, I do see more signs of practical fellowship on the ground as it were. I am often at Oriental Orthodox events where senior Eastern Orthodox bishops attend as honoured guests. And there have been Eastern Orthodox events which I have also attended with other clergy as a guest. I see a lot of Eastern Orthodox in my own little community and most of these folk, though aware of the historical issues, do not see our Orthodox Church as being any different from their own back home.

    I do not see a reunion taking place any time soon, but I do see and expect an increasing porosity in the Churches so that both communions offer hospitality to those of the other communion when it is necessary.

    Father Peter
  • ZoxsasiZoxsasi
    [quote author=Father Peter link=topic=10713.msg131040#msg131040 date=1298019918]
    I have not seen a great deal of progress in the dialogue between the Eastern and Oriental Orthodox communions over the last years. To a great extent this has been because the Churches have been preoccupied with their own internal problems, not the least of which is a hardcore of anti-reconciliationists within the Eastern Orthodox. But there is also the fact that a Russian bishop in some distant place has probably no opportunity of meeting any members of the Oriental Orthodox communion and therefore no urgency in encouraging reconciliation. There is also still a very great ignorance about what we actually believe and so many Eastern Orthodox are concerned that a union could be even considered with those who deny that our Lord Jesus Christ was man.

    On the other hand, I do see more signs of practical fellowship on the ground as it were. I am often at Oriental Orthodox events where senior Eastern Orthodox bishops attend as honoured guests. And there have been Eastern Orthodox events which I have also attended with other clergy as a guest. I see a lot of Eastern Orthodox in my own little community and most of these folk, though aware of the historical issues, do not see our Orthodox Church as being any different from their own back home.

    I do not see a reunion taking place any time soon, but I do see and expect an increasing porosity in the Churches so that both communions offer hospitality to those of the other communion when it is necessary.

    Father Peter


    I find it absolutely remarkable, shameful even, that the leaders of the Orthodox Churches see no urgency in unity and reconciliation. This is pride, and it is destructive.

    I propose that they remember that the Apostles, were gathered in the upper room, on the day of the Pentecost, UNITED IN PRAYER. The Church was strong when they were united.

    They do not see this as an urgency??? THAT IS SICK!!!

    Maybe if someone told them that reconciliation does not mean that we have to say sorry to each other, but rather agree on a few dogmas may help them along, but to take this lightly is unfair.

    Oriental Orthodox Christians may not find themselves welcomed amongst all Eastern Orthodox Christians. They may not be welcoming to them. They may find themselves being welcomed in parts of the world where there is a strong protestant presence around them.

    THis is DUMB!!!!!!! This foolishness is literally destroying the Church.

    If we remain divided like this, the Orthodox Church, of each Church, ends up developing a nationalistic element within itself. But if we were united, the commonality between us, which is the true Orthodox Faith will take precedence over everything. What unites us will surely overshadow the elements that divides us and heal what weakens the Church already.

    A Christian alone is a Christian in Danger.

    We are Coptic Christians alone.
  • ilovesaintmarkilovesaintmark
    Actually, everything is essentially worked out.  After the negotiations and talks in the 90's, it was left up to each individual jurisdiction to approve through their own Holy Synod (local).  In Egypt it was ratified.  The wonderful monks of Athos and their extension into the Ecumenical Patriarchate and Athens prevented any votes in main jurisdictions of the Byzantine Family.

    There is also an exposure for the Byzantines to have to realize that their persecutions and barbarism of the centuries past will have to be acknowledged.  Moreover certain embarassments will have to be dealt with, such as the tiny jurisdictions they call the See of Alexandria.  There is a Greek Patriarch occupying the last hold out of hellenism in Egypt.  With a reconciliation, his see will disappear.  There are just a few Greek churches left in Egypt, and they are not able to hold out against the tide of Islam and the indigenous Coptics.

    They even try to take credit for the missionary work that the Coptic Orthodox Church is carrying out in Uganda, Kenya, Tanzania, South Africa, Rwonda, etc.

    The Greek Patriarch in Alexandria is living on a dream and funds from Athens, no different from the Ecumenical Patriarchal jurisdiction in Constantinople.  Without that aid or acknowledgement, there would be a collapse of both jurisdictions.
  • ZoxsasiZoxsasi
    Sorry ILSM, i didnt quite get that.

    Why are the leaders in our Orthodox Churches not interested in reconciliation - ? why can't they appreciate the urgency of the situation we are all in??
  • ilovesaintmarkilovesaintmark
    The Oriental are for it.

    The Eastern are waiting for each other.  Only the Rumanians ever adopted the issue in their Synod.  They, since, retreated relative to the issues of the monks of Mt. Athos.

    The Eastern still think that they are the vestige of the Byzantine Empire and want an imperial hold.  They also do not want to admit their heinous crimes against us; not to mention that they were wrong.
  • anba bolaanba bola
    I know that there have been attempts at talking with the monks of Mt. Athos. Read the second page of this document: http://soc-wus.org/patriarchate/Statement%202004.pdf

    I think that there are good and bad aspects of this being taken so slowly. Firstly, if the talks are rushed too much there may be misunderstandings among the people (and the monks of Mt. Athos), which could cause turmoil. The bad (very bad!) aspect is that by taking the process slowly the two will remain seperate for longer even though they have the same faith.

    Well, at least that's my two cents on the subject.
  • mabsootamabsoota
    let's keep the dialogue open at the unofficial level, eg. by visiting each other's churches and making long-lasting friendships. this supports the work done by the clergy on our behalf.
    those of us in europe and north america and australia have many eastern orthodox churches in our countries, so we can make a big difference by our friendship and love.
    i remember the welcome i received from a russian orthodox priest in prague on hearing i was coptic 'oh, baba shenouda? i love his books!'

    we can't take Holy Communion yet, but we can worship together and be friends. those of us who know a little theology can also show our eastern orthodox friends that we have the same faith.
    may God be glorified and may His love be in us.
  • Pharaoh714Pharaoh714
    [quote author=mabsoota link=topic=10713.msg131111#msg131111 date=1298111837]
    let's keep the dialogue open at the unofficial level, eg. by visiting each other's churches and making long-lasting friendships. this supports the work done by the clergy on our behalf.
    those of us in europe and north america and australia have many eastern orthodox churches in our countries, so we can make a big difference by our friendship and love.
    i remember the welcome i received from a russian orthodox priest in prague on hearing i was coptic 'oh, baba shenouda? i love his books!'

    we can't take Holy Communion yet, but we can worship together and be friends. those of us who know a little theology can also show our eastern orthodox friends that we have the same faith.
    may God be glorified and may His love be in us.



    That was my main point... If we have the same faith and we love eachother but we don't get along due to political/historical reasons that we are working out.. we still cannot take communion together?

    Didn't some of the Apostles had some disputes such as ST. Paul and St Mark but they still shared the same Faith!
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