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Confess and take communion.
today I was with 2 of my coptic friends and it seems both of them had a different answer to the following question and an argument erupted. I also faced this same argument years ago in sunday school over the same question, it seems like everyone has their own opinion on this subject and i cant seem to find WHAT THE COPTIC ORTHODOX FAITH says about this.
So, As a coptic orthodox what is the correct belief in the following questions.
#1- When are we forgiven our sins? When we go to confession? or When we take comminion?
#2- If our sins our forgiven when we confess, than why do we need to take communion?
#3- If our sins our forgiven when we confess, than dont we go home and sin again and than come to church the next morning and take communion?
#4- If we are forgiven our sins when we take communion, why do we need confession?
#5- Can we confess our sins to God instead of the priest? or Do you HAVE to confess to the preist or else you go to hell as someone once told me.
#6- When we confess to the priest how do we know he wont think any less of us? After all, he is still human and still a sinner.
#7- Why is it you must confess to a priest, why not your parent or a friend.
Thank you for your help.. God Bless
So, As a coptic orthodox what is the correct belief in the following questions.
#1- When are we forgiven our sins? When we go to confession? or When we take comminion?
#2- If our sins our forgiven when we confess, than why do we need to take communion?
#3- If our sins our forgiven when we confess, than dont we go home and sin again and than come to church the next morning and take communion?
#4- If we are forgiven our sins when we take communion, why do we need confession?
#5- Can we confess our sins to God instead of the priest? or Do you HAVE to confess to the preist or else you go to hell as someone once told me.
#6- When we confess to the priest how do we know he wont think any less of us? After all, he is still human and still a sinner.
#7- Why is it you must confess to a priest, why not your parent or a friend.
Thank you for your help.. God Bless
Comments
today I was with 2 of my coptic friends and it seems both of them had a different answer to the following question and an argument erupted. I also faced this same argument years ago in sunday school over the same question, it seems like everyone has their own opinion on this subject and i cant seem to find WHAT THE COPTIC ORTHODOX FAITH says about this.
So, As a coptic orthodox what is the correct belief in the following questions.
#1- When are we forgiven our sins? When we go to confession? or When we take comminion?
#2- If our sins our forgiven when we confess, than why do we need to take communion?
When you confess the sins are transfered as Christ's....when you take communion, you become one with Him and there your sins, that Christ carried, are Fully forgiven and forgotten. Yes...that happpens most of the time. but not all sins are the same...and there always should be control. Becasue you have to tell somone your sins. same as to the concept of wanting somthing from God. God KNOWS what you want and what will happend.....He just need to hear it from you and me....kind of connected to free-will John 20:23
"If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained."
Christ was talking to the apostles, which are today the clergy. they only have that power. the priest must forget all your sins because he is, in that specific time, like Christ. He forgives and FORGETS.
So wait a minute, when our sins are transferred to christ they are forgiven? Or they remain but remain in christ until we unite with him in holy communion?
I know im asking really weird questions and im sorry but i really need to learn this. Is there like any website from the coptic church that teaches these things?
And one more question. You said that the apostles were given the power to forgive sins, and therefore only the fathers of the church can forgive sins.. but than, why can we not confess to the Lord himself? Why a human being?
ive actaully never heard that before... when you said wen we confess our sins are transferred to christ.
So wait a minute, when our sins are transferred to christ they are forgiven? Or they remain but remain in christ until we unite with him in holy communion?
I know im asking really weird questions and im sorry but i really need to learn this. Is there like any website from the coptic church that teaches these things?
And one more question. You said that the apostles were given the power to forgive sins, and therefore only the fathers of the church can forgive sins.. but than, why can we not confess to the Lord himself? Why a human being?
first, our sins are forgiven when we confess, but than what's forgiveness from Someone if you are not united with Him. a prove for that is you can confess anytime. also communion locks confession...how....keeping you clean by actually uniting with Christ.
well if you confess to the Lord Himself, than why not go and take "spiritually" unite with Christ instead of taking communion!!!!
you are leaving on earth, where Christ put people responsible for you. You can't get into heaven with out Christ's sacramnts through their services. other than that, me or you and many others, with all due respect, will not be able to be holy enough to actually BE in the presence of Jesus, not even the Father, and till Him, here is my sins let me help you carry them. am sure we kind of do that, but if you trully have the right feeling when confessing, that is how it happens. YES Christ came for your salvation, and am not denying that, and He is in fact waiting for you to open the door and let Him in....but it's just to fearful to be in God's presence in an unclean soul.
sorry i say to much words...but i hope u understand what am saying.
yea mina got that about right... Only the priest and Upper levels of the clergy have the power to forgive sins and to retain them.
Forgive me for correcting you His Servant, but no one on Earth can forgive our sins for us; the priests and higher clergy have the power to absolve us from our sins, that is after we confess. Priests absolve us from our sins, giving us permission to take communion, and God forgives us once we confess. Theres a difference. Didn't want there to be any confusion among the members of the board, especially the younger and new-to-the-faith.
At confessions the priest, by the power of Priesthood given to him to bind and loose, transfers the sins from the person to the account of Christ. In the Eucharist, the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world will blot all the conffesed sins. In the last sentence of the final confession during the Holy Liturgy, the priest says “Given for us for salvation, remission of sins and eternal life to those who partake of Him. “ In order to simplify the meaning consider the priest giving you a valuable cheque but you cannot benefit from it unless you go and cashed it at the Eucharist.
During the Old Testament, the person who committed sins had to put his hand on the head of a clean innocent animal and confess his sins so that his sins would be transferred to the animal. The person was then absolved of his sins but not been forgiven. The final forgiveness had to await the coming of the Son of God and subsequent His salvation.
This is just a Protestant heresy!!! They rejects the sacrament of Priesthood
Thank you so much safaa,... and you know what??, your right, it WAS a protestant who asked me why cant we just confess to our friends or parents. Thank you everyone for your answers, this is really helpful. BUt Safaa.. i have 1 more question, I fully understand what you are saying about how in the old testament they would put there hands on the head of a lamb and confess their sins and the sins would be tranfered to the lamb but not forgiven... BUT, if i try to explain this to my protestant friend she will say ' BUT NOW JESUS HAS COME AND WHEN WE CONFESS OUR SINS THEY ARE FORGIVEN AND WE DONT NEED IT TO BE CONFESSED TO ANOTHER HUMAN.... What shall i say to her? oh and incase i havent said this before.. she's coptic orthodox, but she doesnt go to church any more, she only goes to the protestants church
well sine this a protestant, this is the concept they believe in. they believe in Jesus by faith and not works. even thoo faith is dead without works. Jesus came to return Adam and his sons to their original place, Paradise by abolishing death, the wage of sin, and opening Paradise. but sinse He is the One who did this, you have to be part of His body. Christ also when He came He doesn't automaticlly sent you to heaven, no. He prepared a place for you their and even should you the ways of salvation, to that specifc place. All you have to do is know how to get there.
another problem with protestants is most of them do not have clergy men, even thoo Christ Himself put some to be responcible for us, and as i posted the verse before, give them power. their authurity is from Christ and Christ will not counterdict Himslef. He put you life into their hands and like i said before, You will not get into heaven without the services they provide, that were givin to them by CHrist Himself.
You and your friend need to understand that you do not argue with what God has established; because Heaven and earth shall pass away but not one word that God the Almighty have said. I will give you these material to read and may the Lord give you grace to understand.
Sacrament of Confession:
The sacrament was instituted by Lord Jesus when He said to His pure disciples: “Assuredly I say to you, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven”. Matt: 18:18, and what He said after Resurrection “As the Father has sent me, I also send you and when He had said this, He breathed on them, and said to them “Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them, if you retain the sins of any, they are retained”. John 20: 21-22
Sacrament of Priesthood –
The sacrament was instituted by Lord Jesus when He chose His twelve disciples among many of His followers, and called them Apostles. That selection was accomplished after a whole night of prayer, when Lord Jesus went out to the mountain (Luke 6: 12-13), and sent them to preach saying “The Kingdom of Heaven is at hand” Matt: 10:7, and said to them: “I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit, and that your fruit should remain”. John 15:16. He gave them the authority saying: “Assuredly I say to you, whatever you bind on earth Will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven”. Matt: 18:18. After the resurrection He “Breathed on them and said to them: “Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them. If you retain the sins of any, they are retained” John 2:23. And to them only, He said: “Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you”. Matt: 28:19-20. He gave the mystery of His Holy Body and Blood only to them saying: “Do this in remembrance of me”. Luke 22:19.
wait i jsut thot of something... if when we confess our sins are transfered to the body of christ (the bread) than isnt it already forgiven because its christs body and he has already died for our sins?
you are right. but He first died for our old sin (it's consequence, pradise closed, hell open for all). than after that, as i said before, since He is the One who did this, you have to be united with Him to be granted that forgivness of sins. Christ died for all of mankind to make them free from the old sin that no one on earth could of redeem us from. but than to fully become part of that gift, you have to be part of Him.....which happends when you take communion.