women are unclean?

pureplaya434

hey,
ok i heard from some of u guys that women are unclean because they have their periods and that is why they cann not enter the altar . But i thought about it and men give a natural discharge as well so that would make us both unclean so what difference would that make?


aghape,
chris

cremedelescremes

I hate that word.....unclean.

socoolbishoy

I agree, I dont like that word.... I dont wanna state an answer, but I have to search it first...

Sinner3712

hmm yah i have no idea where you got that from but i'm almost sure that's not the answer.

However, does anyone have an answer as to why only men can enter the alter?

mmatt95

ok

in the New Testament, there's no such thing as women being unclean, because with the Incarnation of the Word, the Body has become sacred and a temple to the Holy Spirit

The reason women can't enter the altar is not simply because they are women, but because there's no reason for them to enter. In the same way, men and non serving deacons CANT enter the altar either. Only priests and serving deacons can enter.

Besides, communion was sometimes even given through this window in the iconstase so nobody would even enter the altar for communion

As for women not being allowed to take communion during their period; it's because there's blood running out of their body; in the same way someone with a big open wond with blood running out of it can't take communion either. (this last part i;m not 10000% sure of it btw, so don't kill me if it's not 100% correct, it's just what i heard more than once from people/priests)

Unknown

You're right on that last part Hos Erof 1000% ;). In fact if someone happens to bleed after communion, the tissue used to wipe the blood from the wound in fact has to be burnt - H.H.Pope Shenouda is the one who confirms both these points.

mmatt95

interesting facts iqbal, thxn for clearing it up :)

so still what bout the hair and the nails, cause theoratically, blood doesn't go to these parts of the body, i've had a lot of discussions about this at church, and nobody could confirm whethere it's right or wrong :-\

Christi_03

i havent heard very much about the hair and nails thing, as far as i know it should be ok.... if i hear otherwise ill let you guys know....

take care and God Bless!

copt-icboy

Guys,
what about a person who is going into an opertion, they usually take communion in the morning Don't they bleed during the operation? What is up with that?

Unknown

i think they have 2 have an absolution from abouna, i'm not sure though, but i'll ask my foc ???

socoolbishoy

I never heard of a person that took comm. before a major surgery, they take comm. before it by a day of so.... I could be corrected....

pureplaya434

actually wouldnt you think thats the best tyme to take communion before you go into surgery so god will be with you on the operating table :P iono but that was really cool about the hair and nails thing ive never heard that before that is very cool anyway im looking forward to hearing more about this

aghape,
Chris

Roaming

sorry for the bad word here forgive me

so ur saying if a guy wer to masterbaite he wud not be able to receive communion?

cremedelescremes

masturbation is a sin so nobody should be doing that anyway, communion or no communion.

and don't be sorry about the "bad word". Its not a bad word. We should be able to talk about anything if we're mature and spiritual about it and in this case you're definitely benefitting spiritually because now you know of something thats a sin.

mmatt95

ur absolutely right cremedelescremes , but if u do it before communion, u actually aren't allowed to take communion (maybe if u get the absolution from a priest though)

Unknown

but y would u get an absolution from abouna if it's a sin?

mmatt95

because u would go and confess it and get the absolution ;)

Unknown

oooooooooh, srry i'm really really slow lol

pureplaya434

dude i never thought about that about thta tho masterbation itin itself isnt a sin is it its the thoughts you get of adultery while doing it thats a sin ?
the whole subject is a lil x rated but i just wann know

mmatt95

no, i used to think that same thing, but the thing itself is actually a sin for a lot of reasons. There's a great discussion under the following link about this subject:


http://www.coptichymns.net/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=3861&highlight=m+word

Roaming

but isn't it a sin like everyother one? so even if u lie b4 communion u styll get the absolution right?

pureplaya434

ok basically ur sposed to confess at vespers but if you can not make it or have no time during teh reading of the epistles what i do is go in to abouna and he says the absouloution but tahts just me so iono but i think tahts what youre supposed to do

aghape,
chris 8)

Roaming

can u sya that gain in a different wording lol?

wut i mena is dat when u go to abouna during the epistle what happens can u explain dat?

pureplaya434

yeah he basically prays for me the absolution and then i confess if i have tyme but thats just my relationship with abouna i dunt know if tehy all do that
aghape,
chris

Unknown

well i believe you shouldn't say women are unclean because there a creation of God as welll and they shouldn't really be considered that

awad

women are not unclean but i think that the word unclean is only beacuse it was tradition that the women was not very usful, all life was thought to come from the male etc.

??? not sure thu

mmatt95

actually in the Old Testament a lot of things were called unclean lol

women in their period, some kind of meat, like pork
u should check leviticus and those other tora books for that

MovedByLove

Since this is a sensitive topic to the women who are reading these postings, I would suggest that we use a little more discretion with the exclusive language that is used. Traditionally neither women nor lay people in general are permitted to approach the alter table. As a note to anyone who might entertain the notion that women are considered unclean, or that the presence of the woman might defile the sanctuary, I urge you to remember that St. Gregory the Theologian praised his mother Nonna for having ended her earthly life "clinging to the altar table" in the sanctuary.


May the grace of God be with you all

Coptic Angel

ok umm i dont think i should take offense but i quote from awad
"women are not unclean but i think that the word unclean is only beacuse it was tradition that the women was not very usful, all life was thought to come from the male etc. "
what do u mean by that
and especially the part when u said that women were not very usful
i have to say; that is harsh and i dont think that the males were everything back then otherwise why did God create us.
and for this original topic i dont think its because we're unclean but because of what someone was saying b4 i dunt remember who, umm just bec of the analogy to the open wound

i hope i didnt confuse anyone
im really trying to watch wat i say
so excuse me
CA

jfranklin

:)

all life was thought to come from the male etc. "
what do u mean by that
and especially the part when u said that women were not very usful
i have to say; that is harsh and i dont think that the males were everything back then otherwise why did God create us.

He was talking about how in ancient times woman were mistreated by men,abused and considered little better than animals.Sad to say some men even placed more value on their farm animals.Women were considered property with no rights,virtually slaves in their own household.Some people even practiced infanticide,killing little baby girls by exposing them to the elements,letting them die from starvation,cold,etc. It was a cruel,cruel world{it still is actually}. The Lord Jesus came into the world lifting up woman from a place of dishonor to one of equality with men,joint heirs of eternal life.He affirmed their undescribable worth and value,shedding the very Blood of God on their behalf,teaching us to love,respect,even lay down our lives for them and to treat woman as coequals,joint heirs of salvation.

Unknown

well in weddings the priest does say that the man shall be king ;D